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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Bought some Ruger ARX rounds today and shot them out of my SIG Sauer P320 compact 9mm. Fed, extracted, and shot fine.

They are a newer design composite bullet that manages to go through bone and STILL be able to penetrate.

Has anyone had any experience with them in either the 9mm or the .45? I have some for my wife's Bersa Thunder .380 and it shoots (recoil) like a .22 With my P320 9mm it recoils more like a .380 or even .32 than the 9mm.

Here are a couple of links to those that have not heard of it...

Ruger® Ammo | Polycase Ammunition

https://www.usconcealedcarry.com/polycase-inceptor-arx-9mm/
 

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They had a segment on one of the Gun shows about those. Very light weight poly projectile, makes for low recoil and a very fast velocity. They don't expand like a hollow point but the shape and velocity, create quite a wound tunnel in the ballistic gel.
 

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Arx

I've noted these for about a year now in scattered internet safaris. Maybe they're going bigger time with partnering with Ruger to boost recognition. I'm also interested in the weight saving aspect of these. A weight drop of 2 oz per 10 rounds may not seem like much, but for a 15 rd mag it's 3 oz and perceptible.If ARX is able to go to a polymer casing (as I read in another release they were trying), weight reduction could really become an even greater draw. The decrease in recoil is another real advantage improving accuracy and staying on target. Finally, decreased unintended collateral damage/injury to bystanders is always a desirable trait. Obviously, they're more expensive, as all quality defense loads are; but not that much more. Especially for ammo that we don't train with. I plan on buying some just to feel the differences as opposed to just reading about them!
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Love carrying the Bersa Thunder .22 as it weighs nothing, but doesn't have much for real stopping power. It is strictly a back up in case I have forgotten to put in a pistol in my holster, as it resides securely locked up in my vehicle. At least I'd have something better than a knife, and it's darn accurate so head shots would be the ticket. POINT is it's light and I like light. I carry daily. anything to reduce weight is a plus in my book AS LONG AS it can be effective in my defense. These make the pistol whether it is the P320 in either .45 or 9mm I have for carry, or the main carry pistol a S&W Shield .45 much lighter.

Price is not bad when you consider that Walmart sells the Federal HST for $23.00 in our local store (20 rounds) and I am going to Kalamazoo today to pick up the .45 version of ARX for $20.05 for 20. How is that excessively expensive for defense ammo?

They feed out of my P320 9mm wonderful and it's like shooting a .380 for recoil. I can only imagine how the recoil will be out of that light Shield 45 I have!! Don't get me wrong, I can get along with the recoil of the light shield shooting RA45TP which are Ranger T +P 230gr ammo without any real issues. Would be nice, though, to have a little less recoil and be able to get back on target quicker. Think of how many women who are not carrying larger caliber pistols because the recoil is offensive to them "might" carry and shoot a pistol with these rounds??

Light? Many a man has went to the grave shot with nothing but the lowly .22 LR. At 448 ft/lb of energy in the .45 these are worth looking into.
 
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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Bought some more 9mm Ruger ARX ammo today as well as the .45 ACP version Ruger ARX. Doing some shooting this evening, I noticed that on the 9mm it said "Inceptor", I bought these at Dunham's Sports the other day. "THOSE" 9mm Ruger ARX, besides being marked Inceptor on the brass were only 65 grain, and 1620 FPS/ 379 Ft. Lb. The Ruger ARX 9mm +P I bought at Field & Stream in Kalamazoo are 80 gr, 1445 fps / 371 Ft.Lbs. Lower velocity, heavier bullet and the foot pounds of energy is only a difference of 8 ft.LB.

I kind of feel bad shooting up the "Inceptor" branded, lighter bullets at targets since they may be an earlier and phased out run of bullets. Saved the rest of 10 though. ;)
 

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I use the ARX for my 380 acp Walther PPK and P238 (and SIG P230 SL, though I don't carry it) and I plan to use it for 38 special out of my J-frame (after a couple more range sessions). The ARX really shines for the 380acp where the light recoil from a pocket pistol really makes a huge difference in my accuracy and time to draw and shoot. Also, most 380 acp out of a short barrel will fail to expand. I think I read that only the federal HST 380acp's reliably expand, but at the cost of heavier recoil. The same goes for a J-frame revolver, where reliable expansion out of a shorter than 2in barrel means 38 Special +P, and that is pretty uncomfortable shooting. You might as well get a bullet which is designed to do the most damage without expansion.

With 9mm and a larger pistol, and I still say you get better results with the traditional hollowpoints, so I haven't switched to the ARX there. I feel comfortable shooting traditional hollowpoints out of my Shield, so I want to go with the better ballistics. That being said, I say that you should shoot whatever you are most comfortable shooting and gives you the best edge. If you shoot better with the ARX, I say go for it.

If you are trying to reduce recoil from your 45acp, you probably shouldn't be shooting 45acp. But if you can't afford another gun, and you shoot better with the ARX rounds... then sure, go for it.
 

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Been around for a couple years at least . Rugger just pay for some right to slap there name on box's of ammo too .

Not a fan of the bullet design . They tend to tumble fairly often. Expansion is zero and cavity from bullet is limited . Penetration can be more than most would want too,

Compared it to a 115gr like a gold dot +p or hst at +p levels and decide again of poly case ammo is all that or a hst standard pressure 147gr is a great round and a far better price .

You also have leigh ammo version of the polycase but in copper
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
If you all look at this link http://www.luckygunner.com/labs/self-defense-ammo-ballistic-tests/ and scroll down through some of the results and clicking on expanded , or not, HP bullets EVEN from Gold Dot. There is a correlation between shooting HP ammo that once it plugs up, now becomes a fast moving JHP and has every potential of exiting the body, and possible to hit unintended targets. There is a fine line between being able to address heavy clothing on the hollow point and not getting plugged up , nor being able to expand. Several of the heavy .40 caliber test remained around .40 at the end. So some of the very best of the best name brand ammo sometimes do not expand enough to count and become over-penetrating FMJ.

This article http://mousegunaddict.blogspot.com/2016/05/ruger-arx-9mm-p-ammunition-test-and.html shows some good depth of penetration after going through 4 layers of heavy denim into certified ordinance gelatin. So will work well for short barrels, such as the S&W Shield I carry a lot.

Here is a shot bullet from my P320 Compact using Winchester Ranger T RA45T ammunition.



I emailed Winchester/Olin Tech representative this and a few more picture of this lot number that failed to expand. They are sending replacement boxes. Dr. Gary Roberts also noted that on this brand of ammunition, that if the tooling that scores and creates the talon point on the inside of the copper jacket is not changed out soon enough, there is not enough "score" to allow the desired upset unless it is fired form a pistol of 5" or longer. The Winchester Ranger T 9mm 124gr +P in the Lucky Gunner test above also failed to expand as expected, probably from the same lack of sharp tooling.

Point is, that even the tried and true ammo from well know manufactures sometimes have issues with QC and with barriers that plug up the intended HP that "should" and "would" have expanded under other circumstances. THIS Ruger ARX is not subject to clogging, does not over-penetrate like FMJ, and will go though bone and still reach an acceptable depth WITH the non HP point and disrupt tissue with the unique 3 slot design (as opposed to the one that looks like a phillips screwdriver head.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
This article, https://www.americanrifleman.org/articles/2015/10/23/tested-the-polycase-arx-bullet/ from American Rifleman, has a lot more background on the development of the ARX bullet. The idea of the shape and 3 slot design was not random, nor just to make some sort of marketing hype. An excerpt from that articles said.... "PolyCase ballistics engineers—along with third-party aerospace and fluid engineers—spent months experimenting with aero and fluid dynamics using Finite Element Modeling (FEM), which led to the design of uniquely shaped flutes, or channels, the company calls Power Blades. The flutes act to displace the target material using the bullet’s forward and rotational momentum, or “lateral force dispersion.”

It's not a FMJ, but to cloth and bone acts like one. It's not a HP, but in this respect it disrupts tissue and penetrates to be able to hit vitl organs. I have even read of a feral wild boar shot with a .45 ARX that ran of 25 yards to collapse and die.
 

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The show Guns and Gear, they hunted hogs with the ARX, dropped first hog in its tracks. Second hog ran a little and collapsed, both lungs collapsed from hydrostatic shock. Permanent cavity, supposedly massive.
Black Hills Ammo also has around similar to the ARX only all copper.
I would like to see more real world uses before I use it for defensive ammo.
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 · (Edited)
I'm just a consumer, curious, open, but no degree in aerodynamic concerning fluids. However, there are those that seen these that are impressed that are more learned than myself. Dr. Martin D Topper wrote an article and it has this very interesting video link: https://www.dropbox.com/s/r0uq45mx3568w8w/Polycase%20Media%20Day.mp4?dl=0.

My field is more in chemistry, as I am an Associate Winemaker. I have a working knowledge of aerodynamic and worked some years ago for Boeing Airplane Company in Seattle, WA. Whenever they had new ideas, created on the drawing board by their engineers, there was always testing of such in wind tunnels, testing flow, disturbance, turbulence, etc. but they had the advantage of using injections of "smoke" in the wind tunnel to see the effects of various changes and could see the results in the air in the wind tunnel. The one way a person could do similar with something such as the ARX, would be a light coating of some very staining chemical, like Bromosol Green (and others) that would release from the bullet upon impact into clear gelatin and throw a track. High speed photography would almost certainly be a must to see the results.

I thought about a mini wind tunnel for the ARX bullet, but air and water are so different in densities that you would not be able to see the effect of the 3 groves along the bullet.
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
Today I took the Bersa Thunder .380 out to do some testing with the Ruger ARX ammo. I wanted to see how it would do if shot into similar situation to a human torso. I used a piece of flexible rubber scrap that we use to cover tank tops and seal them. it is 1.78mm or about 0.070" think, and pretty resilient. I used it to replace skin. Then I used some Beef Ribs that I bought that are to be used as dog treats, individually wrapped in plastic, that would represent a human's rib. However, anyone familiar with biology structure will know that a cow rib is thicker and larger than a human's rib. So I figured it was the extreme test of rib penetration. Behind it 1 gallon water jugs.

I shot through the rubber, through the rib, and through the 1st jug, which had a large rupture, and into the 2nd jug that almost, but not quite went through the 2nd jug. It hit the other side and caused a crack but the bullet was still in the 2nd jug. This shows me that a torso shot on a human would penetrate skin and bone and also deliver enough energy to drive deep enough to hit the heart, and probably lodge in the back without exiting. This is the lowest of the self defense pistols I have, and wanted to see how it would work. Obviously 9mm and .45 ACP would complete the job in spades.

My wife, who cannot handle very much recoil due to pain and arthritis issues, can shoot this .380 Bersa Thunder, and loves it now that is less recoil. Would it stop a "Bad Guy"? Depends. Most people (90 %) run away at the mere showing of a firearm. If struck, there is the psychological element , "I'm shot!" and then there is the fact that this round should put enough pain and injury to cause panic and flight. Multiple shots might be needed, but multiple shots might be needed on any aggressor regardless of the caliber or bullet, EVEN HST or Ranter T. In other words, THERE IS NO ABSOLUTE guarantee any pistol will kill an intruder.

Below are pictures showing the rubber piece 1.78mm, the rib which is around .257" where the bullet entered, and shows entry and exit. And the pic of the water jug of the bullet entering immediately after the rib, and then the final bullet.



The rubber "imitation" skin...


Bullet enters the rib this side:


Bullet exits the rib:


Ruger 380 ARX enters water jug after just exiting rib.


Ruger .380 ARX bullet after rubber, rib, 2 gallon jugs of water:

 
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I use the 9mm ARX rounds in my PPQ M2 and Walther PPS M2 with a great wound channel. It is light recoil and shoots well. That said it is a high velocity/FAST round and feels like it has a bit more blast. For my Sig 226 I fired one mag through and decided only metal JHP for my defensive round.

To me it is about feel, they feed fine yet the ARX didn't feel good in my Sig were it felt great in my Walthers.
 
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