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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
Hi All,
First post here so please be nice :). I bought a 226 MK25 new this past August, and have shot around 1500 rounds with it in an effort to improve. While I am consistent with the left/right aiming (~1.5" shot group width at 18 yards across 30+ rounds), I've noticed a pattern in my shooting style that I'm not able to improve upon: vertical precision. Specifically, the shots are always higher than I expect them to be, causing me to compensate by aiming low to hit a bullseye. After compensating by aiming low the accuracy improves and I can get +/- 2" to the bullseye @ 18 yards, but I don't like that I have to aim so low to compensate. In my mind, my vertical aiming should be consistent from 5->25 yards.

Here's the data from my most recent shooting trip this morning. the target is a 6" diameter target with a 1" bullseye:

Distance (Yards) | POA below target center to hit bullseye | POA deviation in MOA

......5...............|..........1.5".............|.......29 MOA
......7.5............|..........2.25"............|........29 MOA
......10.............|...........3"...............|.......29 MOA
......18.............|...........5"...............|.......27 MOA

As you can see in the 'table' above, the amount of compensation I need to do is very consistent in terms of MOA. I suspect the 2 MOA fewer drop @ 18 yards is due to bullet drop partially negating the need to aim lower to compensate.

I've tried all 3 of the common aiming techniques in the below image, with results consistent with what the above table shows:


I've also tried the same 3 sight pictures centering on the tritium dots vs. the top of the metal sights, with the same results.

At 10 yards, I use sight picture #1 to hit a bullseye (3" lower on a 6" diameter target).

So here's my question: I assume there's a problem with my technique and not with the pistol, but I'm not able to determine what is wrong. Give the above data, can someone help diagnose my shooting issues? has anyone had a factory fresh firearm with incorrectly installed sights?

thanks!

EDIT: here's a video link demonstrating the behavior with a clamp + a laser: Video Link


P.S. here's a photo of a earlier range trip after ~700 total rounds fired @ 18 yards. 40 rounds total in the photo. you can see the vertical grouping is significantly worse than the horizontal grouping. partially because I'm less consistent vertically, but also because I have to fire, see where the round landed, then adjust my sight picture:

 

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Sight picture #3 is what Sig uses.

Have you seen this?
 

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sigs are sighted at 25 yards, welcome from az.
 

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Put a Dawson Precision sight set on it. Fiber optic front and an all black rear.
I shoot way better with my guns that have these on them.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
Thanks GoneBallisticInAlabama & bearone2.

'breaking wrist up' is as follows:

Problem-Error: Breaking Wrist Upward; Pushing Gun Upward at last second before shot breaks

Probable Causes-Symptoms: Head held up too high & tilted back; body leaning backward; pushing gun forward; strong wrist not locked; no follow through; no solid, firm grip; Flinching

Possible Solutions-Tips: Grip gun very firmly; lock strong wrist; do not tilt head up high or back; do not lean body backward; do not push gun forward just before shot breaks; maintain all fundamentals briefly after shot breaks; emphasize the “surprise break” technique & be surprised when shot breaks (If you see your hands, knuckles, or fingers turn white, then you are gripping the gun too firmly.)

It's possible I'm not gripping the pistol firmly enough. I was told 10 pounds pressure pushing back & 10 pounds pressure forward.

I don't think i'm flinching or pushing the handgun forward as this behavior exists even when firing a laser cartridge & LaserLyte target (and easily able to detect/fix bad problems as I've done in the past when i had my trigger finger touching the grip)

I also practice the 'surprise break' technique, which was a huge help in my first 50 shots or so.

I'll hold my sig more firmly next time and see if that helps, are there any rules of thumb for pressure? (other than 'your shot groups improve' :) )
 

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The Target Image in your post is uʍop ǝpısdn to me. . . . . . . :D


One should be up. May be my computer.

I would rather see a target with the holes all high. Perhaps 10 Schüsse. Then we could tell how high. Use sight picture 3 with the front sight covering the bullseye.

Try that other stuff but here is something you can try when you have time.
Sight picture Three with front sight covering bullseye.
Grip as usual except strong support-hand grip and begin with three fingers pointing at the Target, Trigger finger, and both thumbs. When the moving front sight gets over the bullseye squeeze the trigger. 6 to 10 yards is OK

Come back here with a 10 shot target after three more range trips if it is not too cold. Let us know if you have #8 sights.
 

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Discussion Starter #9
here's a video I just took demonstrating the behavior using the laserlyte & a clamp: Video Link

please ignore the left/right deviation between 1st and 2nd/3rd shots, i bumped the dolly i had the sig clamped to.

the results are consistent and i see the same 3" height over ~10 yards. any ideas?
 

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Lower velocity ammo will impact higher on the target. E.g., are you using Freedom Munitions? If so, consider another test with Lawman or something faster.
 

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I always shoot higher when aiming over the hood of a Ferrari. Shoot rollover prone and aim underneath the belly pan next time.
 

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Just because you have a MK25 doesn't mean you have to shoot like a seal. I guess your definition of good shooting differs from others.
 

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Good shooting BTW and welcome, what # sights to you have and have you considered a change?
FYI-

ImageUploadedByTapatalk1417969603.383427.jpg



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

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Everyone sees their sights differently. If you need to use an unnatural sight picture to hit your natural point of aim, and it bothers you enough, the answer is to change the sights. 1500 rounds is enough to adapt to sights. It sounds like you aren't adapting to the sights on your 226.

Sigs typically are intended to use image 3, which means that the front dot is supposed to cover the target. If you use image 2 as you natural sight picture (as I do), you will hit low. With most of my sigs, I have learned to compensate by aiming high. It sounds like your issue is the opposite of mine. With my 220, which has an aftermarket rear sight, the sights are regulated perfectly for me.

It is not all that unusual in my experience to need to fiddle with fixed sights to get exactly the sight picture you desire. I do it all the time with my CZs and 1911s. I haven't yet made a sight change to any of my sigs because they seem to be very consistent in me needing to aim high but I have certainly considered doing so and may still do so at some point.

In addition to chasing POI/POA, installing aftermarket sights will allow you to pick the type of sights you like. I'm not a fan of 3 dot sights preferring either an all black rear or a rear with a single tritium spot under the center of the rear sight.
 
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