SIG Talk banner
1 - 20 of 30 Posts

· Registered
Joined
·
554 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
My new Legion P226 SAO, with less than 200 rd, just threw an extractor tonight. :(
I have had it for a few weeks now, and since I have a few other new(er) guns, none of them has seen a lot of individual action just yey. As of last week, I had just over 100 to 125 rd through it. Tonight, my bro in law and myself put another 45-55 rd down range. The BIL, just finished with 10 rounds and he put in another mag. First shot went off and then the dreaded double feed happened. :confused:

My (near) vision is a bit challenged. I squint and check...it has a bit of a shiny spot, but looks okay. Wrong! The next shot produces another double feed. I borrow some cheater/readers and put a little flashlight on it. Gone! The claw of the extractor is gone! Less than 200 factory rounds and it fell apart. (I always start out using factory rounds in my new pistols).
I guess I will be contacting Sig on Monday. For the few problems that I have read/heard about with the Legions, I don't recall any problems with the extractors. But then again, I wasn't looking for problem posts, either.
Another shooter at my club has a P226 Legion DA/SA. He has well over 1k through it w/o any issues at all.
Wish me luck fellers!!
 

· Resident Armorer Premium Member
Joined
·
15,104 Posts
Pictures would be appreciated...
 

· Registered
Joined
·
67 Posts
Strange, I guess the extractor received a wrong heat treating, I couldn't explain otherwise.
 

· Registered
Joined
·
5,823 Posts
Good thing i hear about those failures is they will happen in first 100 or so rounds. This is for all MIM parts.
There doesn't appear to be a practical (read inexpensive) way to test each MIM part for hidden flaws, and those occasionally happen. MIM, at it's best, is not suitable for making springs and parts that must flex in operation. While the extractor is not subject to a lot of flexure, physics and design suggest there pretty much has to be some small amount. The claw would be particularly subject to stresses, though I have seen one picture on our forum, I think, showing an extractor that broke near its pivot hole.

Would you pay a reasonable amount extra for a "traditional" machined tool steel extractor? I would. Call me old fashioned, I prefer the previous short extractor and will never buy a new classic P.
 

· Registered
Joined
·
641 Posts
There doesn't appear to be a practical (read inexpensive) way to test each MIM part for hidden flaws, and those occasionally happen. MIM, at it's best, is not suitable for making springs and parts that must flex in operation. While the extractor is not subject to a lot of flexure, physics and design suggest there pretty much has to be some small amount. The claw would be particularly subject to stresses, though I have seen one picture on our forum, I think, showing an extractor that broke near its pivot hole.

Would you pay a reasonable amount extra for a "traditional" machined tool steel extractor? I would. Call me old fashioned, I prefer the previous short extractor and will never buy a new classic P.
If i had the money to use the super metal i found when employed at Baker Huges, being used in subsurface safety valves MP35 all the failure in metal used would not happen.
 

· Registered
Joined
·
554 Posts
Discussion Starter · #14 · (Edited)
Real quick check in.
No, no steel cased ammo. I have never shot that in my pistols. I do have some steel cased 30-06 that I shoot in my replica 1903/A4. It likes it quite a lot. When the extractor broke, my BIL was shooting brand new factory loaded Aguila 124 gr FMJ. That was after shooting a mag full of the same, all without incident. I had put 30 rd of Rem UMC 115 gr FMJ just before that. I brought the Legion that night really only because the guy with the DA/SA Legion wanted to see my SAO.
I was sighting in my two Glock pistols for a match. The two venues where I shoot do not allow reloads. I haven't shot factory ammo in them in so long, I forgot where they hit.
I will try to get usable pics. It may be tough. I'm no photographer, much as I tried in high school.
I ran out of time today, I had a 22 skirmish 1 hr away this morning. Then I drove 2 hrs further away from home for a GSSF match. After the 2 hr ride home, I arrived to a house full of guests and then we went to dinner. I cleaned my pistols and reloaded 10 mags for another GSSF match tomorrow that is 2 hrs away from home again...in a different direction.
I have no doubt that Sig will take care of it. I will call them Monday.
EDIT:
Yes! I would gladly pay the extra $$ for all steel/forged steel parts. To me, it would be worth at least $35 to $50 increase in price to KNOW you are getting quality parts.
 

· Registered
Joined
·
554 Posts
Discussion Starter · #16 ·
Pics and a call to Sig

Well, I called Sig this morning. The first question they asked after I finished explaining why I was calling was, what ammo were you shooting? I told them that there were three different brands of ammo involved that shooting session. Then he said that they usually see that kind of failure (sounding to me like they may have seen some numbers of this failure) with "weird reloads" (his words.)
I told him the brand names of Rem. UMC, Aguila and Federal red box that were used.
He sent me a shipper and explained how the whole deal works, shipping, repair and return. Three to four week turn around...

Here is the slide, next to my 229 SAS slide, which appears to have the same extractor.






 

· Registered
Joined
·
554 Posts
Discussion Starter · #17 ·
On her way back

:D
Just got notice, my P226 SAO Legion is on it's way back from Sig. They replaced the extractor, extractor spring and pin. They put 100 rd thru it without issue. I hope it's all correct now. I really want to love this pistol. It is easy to do...when it runs correctly.
 

· Registered
Joined
·
5,823 Posts
:D
Just got notice, my P226 SAO Legion is on it's way back from Sig. They replaced the extractor, extractor spring and pin. They put 100 rd thru it without issue. I hope it's all correct now. I really want to love this pistol. It is easy to do...when it runs correctly.
Good news!

****

The issue of less than trustworthy parts remains most frustrating. This is a SIG's extractor, MIM, and selling at Top Gun for $32.95



This is an aftermarket tool steel extractor for a SIG EGW 1911 sold by EGW for $39.99 (not likely the same part as above, but shown for price comparison purposes):



I have no idea how much SIG saves using MIM parts. (For those MIM defenders who would jump to SIG's defense, I acknowledge that good MIM can be up to 95% as strong as good quality steel - and *usually* works just fine.) Call me a beater of deceased equines if you wish, I'd still joyfully pay extra to avoid being affected by that 5%.

In my humble and maybe minority opinion, I think it shameful for any manufacturer of life-safety equipment to try to save a buck by not using the best materials and processes available, especially for highly stressed parts which are critical to proper function.

Rant off.

Edit: I recognize that the "5%" I quoted is out of context, and it does not represent a 5% failure rate, but only a degree of "less strength" if you will. However, MIM is not suitable for some purposes, where that 5% less overall strength may be magnified, such as springs or parts that must tolerate flexure.
 
1 - 20 of 30 Posts
This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.
Top