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Discussion Starter #1
I'm considering a new AR10 purchase for the sole purpose of precision shooting. The problem is I'm torn between 6.5 Creedmore and .308 with
a minimum of a 20" barrel.

Just wanting your thoughts. Here's my pros/cons

6.5-
Pro's: Proven more accurate and flatter shooting from 100-300 yards. Softer recoil and more "pleasant" to shoot.
Con's: More or less a "boutique" round. May still be popular 5 years from now, maybe not, making it a harder round to find and then pay a premium for it.

.308-
Pro's: Very common and easy round to find (worldwide) and stockpile. Very accurate particularly in match grade and outside of 100 yards.
Hard hitting.
Con's: Much more recoil, and arguably not as accurate at 100 yards (or any distance with junk ammo). However with a 20" barrel, it would be softer shooting.

BTW, I'm leaning towards the Rock River LAR8. Thoughts? (no flaming please, legitimate question)
 

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Discussion Starter #5
If you shoot only factory, the 6.5 is considerable faster and will lead to a shorter barrel life, throat erosion. I love 308, it's a fun round to shoot and can be made accurate.
Well after checking around, you do have a point. The consensus seems to be as follows (give or take 500 rounds) on barrel life:
6.5 Creed- 3000 rounds
.308- 5000 rounds
5.56- 5500 rounds

However, most were quick to point out we're talking sub MOA accuracy. The barrel still has life past those points, just not quite as accurate. The barrel material and how well you take care of the barrel factors in to (no rapid fire, cooling period between shots, etc)
 

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how far do you want to shoot?
do you want to compete, or just for fun?

6.5CM isn't going anywhere soon, but it may be replaced by 6mm ARC or other...

if you want to shoot sub moa beyond 900 yards, you'll want 6.5CM, because .308 is going to go subsonic before 1000 yards at normal elevations.

personally, i believe patriot should own a .308, but that is jmo.
 

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I'm considering a new AR10 purchase for the sole purpose of precision shooting. The problem is I'm torn between 6.5 Creedmore and .308 with
a minimum of a 20" barrel.

Just wanting your thoughts. Here's my pros/cons

6.5-
Pro's: Proven more accurate and flatter shooting from 100-300 yards. Softer recoil and more "pleasant" to shoot.
Con's: More or less a "boutique" round. May still be popular 5 years from now, maybe not, making it a harder round to find and then pay a premium for it.

.308-
Pro's: Very common and easy round to find (worldwide) and stockpile. Very accurate particularly in match grade and outside of 100 yards.
Hard hitting.
Con's: Much more recoil, and arguably not as accurate at 100 yards (or any distance with junk ammo). However with a 20" barrel, it would be softer shooting.

BTW, I'm leaning towards the Rock River LAR8. Thoughts? (no flaming please, legitimate question)
WEA—— for Hunting the .308 is much more versatile and more effective on Big Game. Accuracy should be well under MOA and closer to 1/2” at 100 yrds with premium Ammo and a good rifle/barrel. For just target shooting - really doesn’t matter. The 6.5 Creed May have slightly less recoil. The 6.5 Creed is a marketing marvel and designed to convince some that they need to buy another rifle - same as the purpose behind most Newly developed calibers. There is nothing the 6.5 will do that is not already being done by a .243, .25-06, .270, .280, 7mm etc... They ALL work just fine....but in order to sell New guns you Must create a “reason” and New calibers seem to do that. Just my opinion, shared by some but Not by all...
 

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Discussion Starter #8
how far do you want to shoot?
do you want to compete, or just for fun?

6.5CM isn't going anywhere soon, but it may be replaced by 6mm ARC or other...

if you want to shoot sub moa beyond 900 yards, you'll want 6.5CM, because .308 is going to go subsonic before 1000 yards at normal elevations.

personally, i believe patriot should own a .308, but that is jmo.
Just for fun and for the challenge, but of course with personal defense in the back of my mind too. Nothing past 300 yards. Don't know of a gun range around my area that has anything past 300 anyway :p
 

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Just for fun and for the challenge, but of course with personal defense in the back of my mind too. Nothing past 300 yards. Don't know of a gun range around my area that has anything past 300 anyway :p
ok, the biggest advantages for 6.5CM over .308 are:
- higher BC and easier wind calls. under 500 yards this matters very little.
- lighter recoil

biggest advantages of .308 are:
- greater energy under 400 yards.
- x2 longer barrel life - particularly if you like mag dumps
- cheap surplus m80 ammo available (can be cheaper to shoot)
- may be easier to scavenge ammo in **** situation from farm houses etc.

i moderately heavy .308 precision gas gun with a brake is not that bad as far as recoil. jmo.
 

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Discussion Starter #10
WEA–– for Hunting the .308 is much more versatile and more effective on Big Game. Accuracy should be well under MOA and closer to 1/2” at 100 yrds with premium Ammo and a good rifle/barrel. For just target shooting - really doesn’t matter. The 6.5 Creed May have slightly less recoil. The 6.5 Creed is a marketing marvel and designed to convince some that they need to buy another rifle - same as the purpose behind most Newly developed calibers. There is nothing the 6.5 will do that is not already being done by a .243, .25-06, .270, .280, 7mm etc... They ALL work just fine....but in order to sell New guns you Must create a “reason” and New calibers seem to do that. Just my opinion, shared by some but Not by all...
Yup, and that was kind-of my point too. Heck I grew up with .243 and .270's And they're still around. But in an AR platform, generally you have only a few choices that aren't a "super boutique" round like .224 Valkyrie. I also agree with what you said about 6.5. It was basically "invented" by Hornady, but still a very popular round from what I can see.
 

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Yup, and that was kind-of my point too. Heck I grew up with .243 and .270's And they're still around. But in an AR platform, generally you have only a few choices that aren't a "super boutique" round like .224 Valkyrie. I also agree with what you said about 6.5. It was basically "invented" by Hornady, but still a very popular round from what I can see.
6.5CM is by far the most popular caliber for PRS, although the pros might run mostly 6MM.

if you are serious about long range shooting, i suggest you join snipershide.
 

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All that the other .308 proponents have said. The .308 is an inherently accurate cartridge and at 300 yards will be just as good as 6.5 C.

As far as recoil I consider the AR 10 / LR 308 the softest shooting platform for .308. I've shot my 18" LR 308 mid length gas side by side with my brother's McMillan stocked match M1-A and the LR 308 is noticeably softer shooting.
 
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This is a picture from my 308. Incredibly accurate. But mine is a custom built bolt gun. And I can reach out to 1000 yards all day long ringing steel.

5 rounds at 100 yards.
AC5F217A-ACA6-4D51-A737-01BE7FD4A528.jpeg

That’s with factory ammo-

4932228B-94D2-4D21-AE34-E02A2DAC60EA.jpeg 15B355D6-7618-42C6-A288-8D65F868DD1C.jpeg

And with a good brake on the gun like this, the gun is very soft shooting. My grandson when he was 3 years old was laying behind this gun taking shots. That shows how soft the recoil is.
 

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Caliber wars are always fun. The arguments about Accuracy, Range, Terminal Velocity and energy vs recoil, flash and muzzle blast are always a lot of fun.
The arguments that Armchair (and Bench Rest) guys have about these are always entertaining. But there are a couple of things that are usually last on the list.

1 Ammunition Performance. Most of these guys hand load. Some of them with needs so esoteric that they measure by 1/10 grain both the Bullet and the powder. And they even measure the case capacity for calculations of pressure increases.
2. Bullet performance. There are books written about how Spitzer based, boat tail, and other strange configurations are made with the idea of the perfect bullet through air, water, rain, bucking wind, and all of the other items that plague a good shooter.
3. Terminal performance. The whole gelatin story with 2, 3, 5 layers of leather, canvas, denim and every other material you can imagine.

All of which are pretty academic when you are talking about a Combat Chassis rifle that was designed to kill people at ranges of 400 (Marine) 1000 (Sniper) yards and other distances in between. (And Beyond).

Leave the esoteric cartridges in the Bolt Action frames. or as a barrel you can change out on your multi chassis frame.
 

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Discussion Starter #15
This is a picture from my 308. Incredibly accurate. But mine is a custom built bolt gun. And I can reach out to 1000 yards all day long ringing steel.

5 rounds at 100 yards.
View attachment 362532

That’s with factory ammo-

View attachment 362526 View attachment 362528

And with a good brake on the gun like this, the gun is very soft shooting. My grandson when he was 3 years old was laying behind this gun taking shots. That shows how soft the recoil is.

Impressive to say the least!
 

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This is a picture from my 308. Incredibly accurate. But mine is a custom built bolt gun. And I can reach out to 1000 yards all day long ringing steel.

5 rounds at 100 yards.
View attachment 362532

That’s with factory ammo-

View attachment 362526 View attachment 362528

And with a good brake on the gun like this, the gun is very soft shooting. My grandson when he was 3 years old was laying behind this gun taking shots. That shows how soft the recoil is.
Nice
 
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